The switch feeding phase or zero?

Floating phase switch the backlight works and the switch visible in the dark, but the lamp driver goes crazy throwing a disco in the dark, floating zero does not light switch. How to do that backlight and lamp not light and not blinking in the dark
March 19th 20 at 09:20
9 answers
March 19th 20 at 09:22
Solution
You bought the most lame light bulb. There the manufacturer decided to save on the resistor. Throw a lamp and not emotes on a normal lamp. I have the whole apartment switches with illumination and there are no problems with blinking lights. Naturally the den phase.
As an electrician I will say that this is the best and easiest. And the switch will need to submit phase. - Roderick commented on March 19th 20 at 09:25
@Roderick, I have the same was the story, the point is, I comes cable under the ceiling, and there is doubling (twisting) on two light bulbs. Neponyatka that only starts when one of the bulbs is removed or rather, the second "loop". Ie if the first base has a lamp it blinks if the second is empty. If you have installed both bulbs, everything works great, and with the backlight switch. You on a physical level can explain why if you have not installed the second bulb, what happens? Noticed purely by chance that after the second blown, then the first to blink. When I inserted the new lamp is burnt, it is first stopped flashing. - haven.Zulauf commented on March 19th 20 at 09:28
Bad lamps with low-quality drivers. Sometimes such lamps that they is such a hindrance... the Wire feeding the outlet is next to the wire going to the lamp. So when plugging in acoustic or radio receiver and enabling this "miracle" of the lamp are such interference that the music is no longer audible. - Roderick commented on March 19th 20 at 09:31
March 19th 20 at 09:24
In fact, all that text can be ignored. A definite answer to your question - a switch should always go phase. It's like the issue of electrical safety.
Sometimes switches that are able to break two contact phase and zero.
I'm not an electrician, but it seems the rules of electrical safety as you said - the phase switch.
But now I honestly don't understand the logic, for me it is safer to apply a zero on the switch for which you every day, hands grasping. To change a light bulb still on the flap is turned off. - Anne.Deck commented on March 19th 20 at 09:27
@Anne.Deck,
To change a light bulb still on the flap shut

Neighing )) - toni17 commented on March 19th 20 at 09:30
@Anne.Deck, I'm also not an electrician, so my guesses why it will likely not true. Common sense - in General, to reduce the number of wires that are constantly under phase. Situations when something can wire to go wrong - a million - in the case of the lamp will be ground on the Chuck in the wall in the light, but anywhere. Therefore it is better to leave 1 garantirovany device (switch) under it than a bunch of unknown.

Sure there's still some sort of connection with the ground, but knowledge lacking already. - Cody.Kozey37 commented on March 19th 20 at 09:33
@Cody.Kozey37, grounding and.
Tearing phase only so that when you turn off the switch at the cartridge has not been guaranteed phase and it is possible to replace a faulty (Korotkova hull) light bulb without getting electrocuted. And to replace the cartridge or replace with wet hands, standing in a full tub. - Vaugh commented on March 19th 20 at 09:36
March 19th 20 at 09:26
If you come to switch both wires (phase and zero) and then from the switch going to the lamp is also two, the illumination of the switch can be connected in parallel with the lamp. Backlight switch will glow always, but the driver lights don't go crazy. For example:
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March 19th 20 at 09:28
buy a lamp with a dimming
And how will it help? - adella.Mohr46 commented on March 19th 20 at 09:31
@Andreane_Beahan, Nothing ironic. Dimming is certainly nothing at all. But to find one another will certainly need. View website lamptest.ru there among the many parameters of the lamps is working with switches with indicator light. Ie You exactly what you need other lamps. - Pierce.Donnelly commented on March 19th 20 at 09:34
March 19th 20 at 09:30
I'm not an electrician, but if the LED lamps, according to the driver, the lights in the switches is prohibited. But to get somehow to work it is necessary to modify the switches or lamps to add a resistor to eliminate disco. But it's a crutch, you need to give up these switches. Another option to bring to lighting a separate branch, but that's nonsense.
the lights in the switches are prohibited

who, where, when?! Why?! - Susana62 commented on March 19th 20 at 09:33
March 19th 20 at 09:32
1. open the SAE lighting requirements - 6.1.36. Install fuses, automatic and non-automatic single pole switch the neutral wires in networks with grounded neutral is prohibited.
2. buy lamps that are compatible with the switches with led (contain the required shunt inside).
3. to put an analogous fashion to the above-mentioned parallel to the load (lamp) shunt resistor of at least 2W, resistance and 50kω quite enough.
March 19th 20 at 09:34
The switch and 3 wires (depends on the connection diagrams with terminal boxes or without), but to tear the switch is just a phase (including a pass switch as you).
This and the EMP, and "concepts".
According to the EMP above is the explanation, writing in "concepts", as a former electrical engineer.

Tear it phase only so that when you turn off the switch at the cartridge has not been guaranteed phase and it is possible to replace a faulty (Korotkova hull) bulbs without the risk to electric shock and to replace the cartridge. Or to do the repair with wet hands, standing in a full tub=)

As for flashing the backlight in the switch or the lamp - you just have to use other who is able to work properly with lighting. Lamptest in your hands, there is all infa there.
Or to do the repair with wet hands, standing in a full tub=)


Standing in the bath, you are grounded.

The lamp is usually supplied "Zero".

Usually there's a voltage. - rose_Lebsack commented on March 19th 20 at 09:37
@rose_Lebsack,
Standing in the bath, you are grounded.
The lamp is usually supplied "Zero".
Usually there's a voltage.

This is not a standard situation. This "usually" should not be. Well, the RCD in the panel has not been canceled, it will work for your example (because there is leakage current, and to zero in the RCD current is less than phase → RCD works).

Google yet what the COOP (box potential equalization), why it is and how it is used in residential construction.

Moreover, to prevent the situation from your example, in simple terms, the earth must be connected to the zero ("zeroing"), for example, in the dashboard or at the substation, depending on the type of the applied grounding system.

Googling "of earthing TN-S, TN-C, TNC-S, TT, IT" — what is the difference and how they work. - Vaugh commented on March 19th 20 at 09:40
@Vaugh, I am an electrician said that in order to check the grounding, it is necessary via the machine zero to file on the ground if turned off, then the ground as he says "good", is it possible to believe it, or better multitester to know how to check? - Andreane_Beahan commented on March 19th 20 at 09:43
@Andreane_Beahan,
necessary via the machine zero to file on the ground

No clear wiring diagram. Zero do machine tear can not (rather, it is phase, can be double machine for single-phase connection+zero or 4 modular for 3-phase+zero). Separately to zero the machine cannot be placed totally! because in the event of an emergency, if there are 2 separate machine, and work the machine to "zero" — phase conductor will remain energized (as if the machine does not) and the consequences can be sad.

The tester can check 2 things:
1. The voltage between ground and zero (must be 0)
2. The connection between the earth and zero (the tester should beep, but if no beeps — it does not mean anything, just the ground may be different)

In General, put at least one RCD (input, for example) or an RCD on each group or change existing machines to diffy exactly the same value and sleep well. - Vaugh commented on March 19th 20 at 09:46
In General, know that the task of the machine in the first place — to prevent the heating cable to melt the wiring and that the cable itself shorts out. The machine is NOT to protect people, and protect the cable (because the cable change — hemorrhagic).
Therefore, any machine (not to be confused with ouzo!) will disappear in 3 cases:
1. Exceeding the allowable temperature
2. Exceeding the allowable current
3. Short circuit (this is a special case of claim 2. In short — the "instantaneous" increase of current to very high values and if the machine will not switch off — will be strong heating of the wires and it melted as if the whole wire is the filament of the incandescent bulb).

The goal of the RCD to protect against electric shock (for example, standing on the wet bathroom floor to grab the faulty dryer, which is plugged into the outlet) — RCD recognizes that person has current and will turn off (a machine — no. You for the machine = light, only the more resistance).

Is diffstat (differential machine). It's just RCD + normal machine in a single housing.

Total, in any case, put at least one RCD (input, for example) or an RCD on each group or change existing machines to diffy exactly the same value and sleep well.

Just keep in mind that the RCD can't disconnect in excess of par value (unlike diffentiate), it will simply burn out. Therefore, the nominal value of the RCD it is necessary to choose higher than the value of the machine at stage 1 to the RCD is guaranteed to "survive" until the work machine. I.e. if the opening machine 50A, the RCD should be put 63A.
If the opening machine (or line of some sort), for example, 20A — you can put ANY ouzo, which is above the level (25A, 32A, 40A, etc.) that are cheaper. - Vaugh commented on March 19th 20 at 09:49
@Vaugh,
The machine does NOT protect

What does protect or not protect, I ask if I can help somehow to test the reliability or even the existence of the ground, throwing zero to the ground through the machine, the assurances of my friend the electrician - if machine "to shoot", it is an indication that the grounding is properly - Andreane_Beahan commented on March 19th 20 at 09:52
@Andreane_Beahan, I don't know if you can help the machine to check the reliability of grounding, I repeat that I do not understand why it can work, it is some nonsense, to be honest.

Ground zero, in simple language, and so connected in the panel or at the substation (depending on the grounding scheme), so it is not clear why such a perverted will work (machine cut), and most importantly, a sign of what will be vrubilsya machine. KZ? Where? Phase no, there is no voltage, currents no. Conversely, if there is a potential difference between zero and ground (ie, somewhere already has a breakdown phase and the faulty electrical system), then when the circuit of the machine, of course, can decide what is short circuit and cut — i.e., exactly the opposite than in your example ("if the machine works, then everything is OK").

Again. Googling "of earthing TN-S, TN-C, TNC-S, TT, IT" — what is the difference and how they are organized, how they work, where and how is connected and a protective zero Explorer, I'm too lazy to repeat the Internet.

For example,
How does the grounding on different circuits grounding electrik.info/main/electrodom/1006-kak-sdelat-zaze...
The main types of ground https://samelectrik.ru/osnovnye-tipy-sistem-zazeml...
there is a separate article for each grounding pattern https://samelectrik.ru/elektroprovodka/zazemlenie-...
Then do: https://yandex.ru/search/?text=схемы%20заземления%... - Vaugh commented on March 19th 20 at 09:55
@Vaugh, about what I had read. But the reality stands: In the Krasnoyarsk territory everywhere soundly me cheerfully pulled if you rely on the battery and the system unit at the same time. This RCD was either absent or did not work... - rose_Lebsack commented on March 19th 20 at 09:58
March 19th 20 at 09:36
Alas, the backlight will have to part
March 19th 20 at 09:38
First, the switch to bring the necessary phase.
Secondly, that the lamp is not blinking, it is necessary to add a capacitor 630 V and a capacity of 0.1 UF connected in parallel with the lamp

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